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PostPosted: Mon Oct 27, 2003 10:50 pm 
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I've been stopped by the security guards in the mall because of doing magic and drawing a huge crowd in the mall.


They said I was asked to stop by the owner of the mall...and that I was obstructing the walkways (because of the huge crowd). Then the guards followed me around everywhere until I left.


That was an upsetting day.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 27, 2003 10:56 pm 
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born to perform.

Joined: 13 Jul 2003
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Location: Virginia
Cool what tricks were you doing?
I can't seem to think of anything that would attract a big crowd. Seems like I need work. :oops:


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 27, 2003 11:09 pm 
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I can't remember all I did...but I know I was in the middle of twisted sisters when I got the boot.


I wasn't doing anything special as far as tricks are concerned. Its all about presentation and having the magic down...not the trick itself. You got to work on your presentation skills and making sure you can do the magic flawlessly...and you will get a crowd going with ease with even the most basic of tricks. I do it all the time (ambitious card, card transposition, invisible deck...other basic staples like that).


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2003 12:28 pm 
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Location: england
in england you have to get a licence from the counce. In some places, covent garden for one you have to do a test to be able to work here. This is because covent garden its very high class performing and there are many people.

Tom


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2003 4:55 pm 
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one thing to at least note here...

A lot of places have bartering ordinances. So if you are accepting cash, donations, etc in exchange for your entertaining them, you could very well be in violation. These are primarily in place for the "will work for food" ppl, but you'd still fall under that ordinance if accepting cash/donations. Oddly enough, holding a sign that reads "i need money" doesnt fall under the ordinance b/c you arent offering anything in exchange.

Since their only purpose is to deter the panhandlers, the licenses are free in most places.... so you'd be foolish to chance a fine & not at least check it out (that is, if you accept cash/donations).


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 Post subject: Re: Street Magic Illegal?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2003 7:00 pm 
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Joined: 15 May 2003
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Location: Texas Ring 15 Ren Clark
flip2005 wrote:
Have anyone been caught or just frowned upon when doing random tricks in random places? I was just wondering because it would suck to get yelled at because you were just trying to entertain someone. I would seem some businesses would get mad at you for drawing a crowd in a mall or using their space to show some guy a card blistered in your fingers. Where should I NOT perform and what's all this about a liscence and such for magic :?:
Yes I have been kicked out of malls and from what I hear some down towns have panhandling laws for street performers. But it is'nt going to stop me from going Down town to try to make a living! :twisted:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2003 6:12 pm 
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The legal issues of street performing vary from place to place. If you're in a public place on public property, it's a form of free speech, which is constitutionally protected. Be aware, though, that malls and many other places are actually private property. In the case of private property, you have to get the permission of the property owner.
Many cities have permits, some of which could be challenged and probably beaten in court, but who has the time, money, and effort for all that?


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2003 10:32 am 
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[quote="robsigns"]The legal issues of street performing vary from place to place. If you're in a public place on public property, it's a form of free speech, which is constitutionally protected. [/quote]

I don't think it's a form of free speech that is protected like other speech. If you cause a crowd to appear in a public place and it causes a disturbance, then your right to free speech may be abriged by that guy with the badge and the billy club. That's why cities can make you get a Busker's license for public performances. Yes, constitutional protection, but not as much as you'd like.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2003 11:02 am 
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Theoretically, you're still covered by free speech, but when people start reacting to magic, as many do, by swearing, screaming, etc, it's no longer you but the crowd that is causing a problem in many people's eyes. It sucks because these are reactions many of us find the most thrilling, but they get stifled in public. Just watch your back, and if you see a cop approaching, try to finish up before a problem arises.

I train in martial arts with many officers, and I've asked them about this. They are Connecticut police, which is a VERY conservative state, and they told me that as long as my audience isn't going nuts, I won't even get the attention of most officers. They also said that if the officer is a decent guy/gal, they might appreciate being asked to participate. Just a thought...

Pj


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2003 1:35 pm 
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Yeqh when I was down twon one day I seen some police officers and just walked up to them and said ,"hey you like magic? They started watching and then afterwards handed them a business card....I'm sure if it was illegal they would of said something but..even if it was I think I'm on there good side :D


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2003 2:13 pm 
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You guys just touched on the important point. Whatever the formalities, in most places, cops arent' going to enforce busking laws where no problems exist. However, the laws are necessary in places like Chicago: for example, at The Taste of Chicago, over a million of people are in Grant Park at any given time. Street performers could make a ton of money setting up shop along Michigan Avenue as the hords of people flock to the park. If you have a license, then you know the rules about not blocking the sidewalk. So the cop can nail you for doing that. If you don't have a license, then you may not know the rules, so the cop can fine you or warn you that you need a license. So they're covered in both cases with this rule.

Which bring me to my other point regarding free speech and the crowd. The police will ask the crowd to disperse, but it will be the street performer who will be fined for not having a license, or who will have his license yanked for not following the city ordinance. So whatever you think about the First Amendment, you have no right to disturb the peace or cause congestion in a walk-way or street. The freedom of speech is not complete and I doubt the Supreme COurt would ever rule that a municipality cannot create a law designed to preserve safety/peace where it causes hardly any infringement on one's 1st AMendment rights (It's not like it's politcal speech, and you can still perform in the streets)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 1:12 pm 
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What about Disney World Or Las Vegas. I plan on just going around w/ a camera much like Oz does in BTP. If I'm not collecting $$$ is it ok?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 2:24 pm 
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^ya im kinda interested in this topic... i was actually gonna go try to freak out some ppl on bourbon street(N.O.) and get my friend to record it... is that illegal?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:18 pm 
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Location: asylum Occupation: unemployed Hobbies: full-contact origami
if i understand correctly, Disneyland is private property. So, it really doesn't matter if it is legal or not. If they ask you to stop, or leave, you really don't have a choice.

as for Las Vegas, can't answer that. But if you are on hotel/casino property, the same thing would apply.

but who cares. Just do it. If you're young, most likely you'll be given a warning, assuming you pretend to be ignorant of the law.
and just make sure you do your performance between 29 Dec and 1 Jan as I'll be in Vegas then. Just don't do it too late on the 29th as that is when I'll be seeing Penn & Teller.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2003 4:31 pm 
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when i want to drum up some business i hit the streets and i'll perform all my magic for free and then every person that i interact with gets a playing card with my business info on it.(i used blank faced cards and laser print my info on them) ive given my cards to cops , mall security , ushers at theaters and just about anybody i can get my hands on. but i think that the fact is ive never asked for money and i always keep a extremely friendly demeanor with every one. most places actually happen to understand that if someone draws a large crowd in front of their store, chances are most of those people will end up in the store. everybody wins!!


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