many routines (triumph, card warp, out of this world,...) have one creator and have been adapted to better or worse over the years. who can be credited with collectors? i am asking because somewhere someone claimed that the original collectors is by daniel madison, but i just cannot imagine the effect being that "new".

replies appreciated,

kit

It is by Roy Walton

roy walton was my guess but it was not on the wikipedia list of his effects and contributions. is it in one of the two "the complete walton"?

replies appreciated, as always..

kit

Yes, it is. The original wasn't quite like the modern version. Same plot, but he only used three cards to find two selections. Ed Marlo started using a four of a kind to find three selections.

There's actually someone in this world that think Daniel Madison created the plot? That right there is the reason so many older magicians can't stand so many newer magicians. No appreciation for history.

thank you so much - that was the information i was looking for!

i went to the magic circle meeting yesterday where person A performed card warp. person B asked who created the effect and i said that it is by roy walton. person B said he had never heard of roy walton, and i said that he is actually quite known and that he also created "collectors" and "out of this world". i was verbally slaughtered for saying that, somehow i confused paul curry and roy walton and the "out of this world" effect. (inexcusable, i know...) definitely my mistake and i was quick to admit it. i also was accused of disrespecting long-time members when i disagreed with crediting marlo with the "collectors" plot. so lots of clearing up to be done...

i am the youngest member in my magic circle (26 years old) and i am also very interested in the history of magic. there is only one effect which i perform regularly without knowing who created it.

it is actually kevin ho who in his manuscript "smooth operations" says that daniel madison introduced him "to the idea of finding cards through the process of finding other cards". that is where i got it from, but admittedly i made another mistake by just mistakenly remembering that someone credited daniel madison with "collectors" - as opposed to "got inspired by..."

sorry for getting so confused, i guess i am just finding it hard remembering all theses names and effects and so forth...

so thank you for clearing things up!

So... guys that had never heard of Roy Walton got upset with you for miscrediting Out of This World to him instead of Paul Curry? That'd be the first thing I pointed out to them. Ed Marlo didn't create the Collector's plot. He just discovered that the effect is more clear when using a four of a kind instead of a three of a kind, which seems to be almost unanimously preferred.

In the 16 years I've been doing magic, I've learned one important point. Magicians suck. Over all, magicians really do suck. Some are great, but so many magicians, including guys that have never really contributed to magic on a large scale, have incredible egos. Going off because you credited a trick to Roy Walton instead of Paul Curry, especially when they don't know who Roy Walton is, is a prime example. Let's hope your experience improves next time.

i might perform the original collectors, then talk about how marlo used four instead of three kings and perform his routine, then perform a third modern collectors routine. nobody should have a go at me after that!

I wouldn't recommend that as a routine. The specs would get bored. Trust me. I'm a sandwich guy and too many of those will bore a spec to tears.

i was not serious anyways. but as a matter of fact, i am also a sandwich guy and have found myself cutting out parts of my routine according to how the spectators react. but that is actually why i like sandwich routines, since you can stop when you believe that people have had enough!