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 Post subject: Doubling Up...
PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 2009 11:08 pm 
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Hello guys! I was just wondering if any of you know any good resources that teach methods on how to Double up. I'm looking for detailed books and/or DVD's. I don't prefer anything that just briefly touches over the subject, but I would like something that goes in detail over it. I have developed my own method which calls for a little misdirection, but I would like to learn how to do it without the misdirection needed. Any help would be apreciated.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 12:41 am 
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I've been around cards for nearly 30 years. What do you mean by "Doubling Up?"


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 1:35 am 
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DaveV wrote:
I've been around cards for nearly 30 years. What do you mean by "Doubling Up?"


It couldnt mean DL could it? :?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 1:39 am 
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It couldn't be that easy, could it?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 1:46 am 
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DaveV wrote:
It couldn't be that easy, could it?


http://www.classicmagic.net/tricks/s205a.php

Quote:
This is done by doubling up the card until it is only 1in. wide, rolling it up, and putting it into the wand, ...

I.e. Folding it in half...

Dont think it is right, maybe it is, but thats what google popped out.
Maybe he is asking how to fold it in half undetected... :?
Guess we'll have to wait for a reply.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 2:27 pm 
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Hi guys. Sorry if you didn't understand what I meant, but Doubling up is the process where you pretend to out jog a selected card in the middle of the deck (while the faces are pointing to the spectator[s]!), but in reality your out jogging two cards (one hiden behind the selection) so you may side steal/botom palm/cull the selected card. This way you can appear to be pushing the selected card into the deck when you've really palmed the card and/or controlled it to the top/bottom of the deck. This helps with many tricks that are card penetrations, so long as you can palm the card. It can also help convince any suspicous spectators their card is in the deck by tricking them to push a false card in instead. I asked my local magic shop owner and he showed me one method that seems to be working for me. I would still would like to get more insight on this sleight as it seems very useful and full of potential.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 4:45 pm 
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Allan Ackerman uses a technique very similar to this. It's rather well known, but I don't recall the name at the moment. Marlo's ATFUS (Any Time Face Up Switch) comes to mind, but that could be something else entirely.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 8:05 pm 
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This technique is well know, so you're probably thinking of what I'm thinking of. I don't recall anything about Marlo using this, but I will look into his method. As for Allan, well I don't know if he uses this, but his name comes to mind when thinking about it now. If I just had the name of the slight I might remember it... I know Brian Tudor uses this in his Heckler DVD, but I'm looking for alternate methods so I may choose my preferance. Plus Tudor never states it's name, he only says to use your own method for "Doubling up" the cards. Anyway, do you know where I can find Marlo's ATFUS, books/ DVD's? Thanks for the help.

P.S. Sorry but I'm very busy this week (personal reasons), so I'm having difficulty finding time to post... but if your here right now that would be great. I have time now, don't know about later...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 9:52 pm 
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born to perform.

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DaveV wrote:
Allan Ackerman uses a technique very similar to this. It's rather well known, but I don't recall the name at the moment. Marlo's ATFUS (Any Time Face Up Switch) comes to mind, but that could be something else entirely.
I believe it's just ATFU Switch but it doesn't matter because I don't think that is what he is looking for. Ed Marlo's Convincing Control is similar to what he is describing. That thing (or some small variation) has been published all over the place. I know that it's taught on Bill Malone on the Loose Volume 4 but I'm sure there are plenty of other sources including some Marlo manuscrips that you'd probobly much rather have.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 9:58 pm 
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I found a reference to ATFUS. It's not what I thought it was and probably isn't what you're looking for. I still think Ackerman uses the technique you seek, probably a variation of Hofsinzer's spread control. In that one, you upjog a selected card along with an indifferent card. In the action of pushing the card flush, you steal the selection and they see the back of the indifferent card being pushed into the deck.

Is this closer to what you're looking for? I think Michael Ammar describes it in the "Arcane" issue of Magical Arts Journal (available for download here , but I'm sure it's in one of Ackerman's books as well.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 11:05 pm 
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Yeah thats it! It's like the Hofsinzer spread control, although the method I use is a variation. It has a minor subltlety that makes them see their card go into the deck. As you push in their card (with the indifferent card on top) you start off with the faces toward the spectators. At the same time you slowly move your hands down (so the backs begin to face the spectators) and strip out the card. It's very much like a retention vanish in coin magic. It follows the principle of delayed vision (how your eyes see like a fourth of a second late) so the spectator can almolst clearly see the card go in, but at the last second it is controlled to where ever you please. This way the eyes are fooled. Now, I have seen the Hofsinzer spread control done, but I have never used it so I don't know how to do it properly. Any resources I can look into?

P.S. I will look into the Convincing control by Ed Marlo. Sounds interestingly convincing...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 11:10 pm 
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Found it (Hofsinzer's spread control) in Advanced card control by Allan Ackerman. Thinking about buying it if it is a good resource. Waiting on some opinions.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 12:42 am 
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For $10 you can't go wrong with Ammar's write up I posted earlier.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 6:41 pm 
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I'll probably get both...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 9:21 pm 
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Tyran101 wrote:
Found it (Hofsinzer's spread control) in Advanced card control by Allan Ackerman. Thinking about buying it if it is a good resource. Waiting on some opinions.


I have two volumes of Ackerman's advance card control. He teaches the material very quickly but there is a lot of good material in each volume. I would recomend it for anyone who is in at an intermediate level.


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