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 Post subject: NEWBIE learning new moves
PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 12:57 am 
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Penguin

Joined: 02 Apr 2011
Posts: 51
I am new to magic (just a month old)

i have learnt a few routines and a few moves.
what should i learn next?

i have learnt :
ultimate transpo
ambitious card
two card monte
biddle trick
basically every tricks in the born to perform dvd.
i have also learnt the hitman (i think it is the easiest and the one which gets the best reaction)
and clutch.

so what routine/MOVE should i learn next?


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 Post subject: Re: NEWBIE learning new moves
PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 4:47 am 
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born to perform.

Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 2753
That is a great repertoire of effects. I would focus on those for a while. Try to perfect them. Think not only of performing the moves but how to best present them. As for new stuff, I would start focusing on improving the moves(sleights) taught in Born to Perform. That way you are still perfecting the tricks you already know but you are just replacing certain moves used to perform those effects with better moves.

As a beginner I would recommend starting with the DL. It will be a workhorse sleight for beginner and intermediate card magicians(advance card guys tend to use it less and less) You might as well find the DL that you like now as it will likely be with you the rest of your life. I know a lot of pros swear by the basic DL taught in BTP but I just don't think it looks natural. For me I went with a "flashier" DL, others go for a more "natural looking" DL. Search youtube for demos of the following DLs. Push off DL, Strike DL, Diving Board Double, Knock Out DL, and Derek Dingle DL. There is a great DL that Chris Beason uses but for the life of me I can't remember the name. I'll get back to you with that.

EDIT- as a side note...only a month? You likely don't need to be doing anything other than working on what you have right there. "An Amateur practices an effect until he gets it right. A Pro practices an effect until he can't get it wrong."


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 Post subject: Re: NEWBIE learning new moves
PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 5:12 am 
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Penguin

Joined: 02 Apr 2011
Posts: 51
yeah
one month
i think i have perfected the DL (without pinky break)
i also worked on the emsley count and biddle count
(that's probably the only three moves needed in all the tricks i know)

so you think i should learn all the moves in the born to perform DVD b4 moving to the next step??

and i don't really nderstand about the DL thing.
Is it just search it in youtube and learn those moves??


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 Post subject: Re: NEWBIE learning new moves
PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 12:00 pm 
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born to perform.

Joined: 19 Nov 2006
Posts: 2571
This is going to sound very arrogant but here goes: there's really no way in the world that you've actually mastered ANY of these tricks\moves.
The "next" thing you need to do now is actually practice these sleights day and night, in front of a mirror, before you go to sleep, when you wake up, in front of a camera, in front of your family and friends, while talking and pattering, just the sleights, etc.
I like to think about sleight of hand as a form of martial arts, it's something that needs to be practiced for years, even the most basic and simple sleights require years of practicing, trial and error and then more practicing until you finally understand them.
I've been doing card magic for about 6 years and only after about 4 years I finally had that feeling that you get when you do a sleight and it feels like this is how this sleight was meant to look and feel in your hands, the feeling that makes you think "this is the core of how I'm going to be doing this sleight for the rest of my life"
Even today, if I practice one hour a day and I do three double lifts that feel PERFECT I go to sleep satisfied, it's not that I only get 3 good DL's, but only 3 will feel RIGHT.
I used to look for the hardest, most difficult, rare, esoteric and weird sleights out there and try to master them, but as I grew older I realized that the most difficult sleights are actually the most basic ones.
Sleight of hand isn't only about learning new moves, it's also about learning how people react to your body language, when's the perfect time to execute the sleight, how to misdirect even the most difficult spectator.
These sort of things take years of experience to get the hang of, but you shouldn't be bummed about it, you should be very excited because the first years in magic are without a doubt the most fun.
Lastly, I'd like to tell you about an interview with a Shalon monk that I saw a long time ago, he said that he practices kong-fu every day for like 15 hours and if he gets one perfect punch, then it was a good day.
Right now, with the sleights you've learned, you have enough to practice for at least a year, but obviously you're eager to learn more, and that's understandable, I don't know what to recommend to you, just think about what I wrote and try your best to practice what you've already learned and not constantly look for new things to learn.
Peace.


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 Post subject: Re: NEWBIE learning new moves
PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:48 pm 
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born to perform.

Joined: 28 Dec 2002
Posts: 4064
Location: London, England
I think the next thing to work on is presentation. It is often overlooked but is certainly the most important part of being a good magician. There are books like "Strong Magic" or "Maximum Entertainment" that will give you a real insight as to what makes magic magic (hint: it's not all about learning lots of moves). Even the relatively cleap "Secrets of Alkazar" contains some valuable theory lessons on how to present something as magical.

Make sure to read a theory book early on in your voyage of learning magic, and it will surely put you on the right path.


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 Post subject: Re: NEWBIE learning new moves
PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2011 10:40 pm 
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born to perform.

Joined: 22 Mar 2003
Posts: 3251
Location: of my spongeballs eludes me.
For presentation I recommend watching a lot of other professional magicians and look for fine points and nuances depending on the style you might be interested in. Contrary to other's opinions it IS OK to copy them as one will (should) form their own style over time, just as musical performers cover other band's material. When you get to the level of public performances it becomes proper to credit the originators of a specific performance and in some cases contacting them for their permission.


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 Post subject: Re: NEWBIE learning new moves
PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 3:02 am 
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Penguin

Joined: 02 Apr 2011
Posts: 51
daniel116 wrote:
This is going to sound very arrogant but here goes: there's really no way in the world that you've actually mastered ANY of these tricks\moves.
The "next" thing you need to do now is actually practice these sleights day and night, in front of a mirror, before you go to sleep, when you wake up, in front of a camera, in front of your family and friends, while talking and pattering, just the sleights, etc.
I like to think about sleight of hand as a form of martial arts, it's something that needs to be practiced for years, even the most basic and simple sleights require years of practicing, trial and error and then more practicing until you finally understand them.
I've been doing card magic for about 6 years and only after about 4 years I finally had that feeling that you get when you do a sleight and it feels like this is how this sleight was meant to look and feel in your hands, the feeling that makes you think "this is the core of how I'm going to be doing this sleight for the rest of my life"
Even today, if I practice one hour a day and I do three double lifts that feel PERFECT I go to sleep satisfied, it's not that I only get 3 good DL's, but only 3 will feel RIGHT.
I used to look for the hardest, most difficult, rare, esoteric and weird sleights out there and try to master them, but as I grew older I realized that the most difficult sleights are actually the most basic ones.
Sleight of hand isn't only about learning new moves, it's also about learning how people react to your body language, when's the perfect time to execute the sleight, how to misdirect even the most difficult spectator.
These sort of things take years of experience to get the hang of, but you shouldn't be bummed about it, you should be very excited because the first years in magic are without a doubt the most fun.
Lastly, I'd like to tell you about an interview with a Shalon monk that I saw a long time ago, he said that he practices kong-fu every day for like 15 hours and if he gets one perfect punch, then it was a good day.
Right now, with the sleights you've learned, you have enough to practice for at least a year, but obviously you're eager to learn more, and that's understandable, I don't know what to recommend to you, just think about what I wrote and try your best to practice what you've already learned and not constantly look for new things to learn.
Peace.




very interesting and thanks for the advice.
i think i should work on presenting and 'perfecting' all my tricks b4 moving to the next step


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 Post subject: Re: NEWBIE learning new moves
PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 4:32 pm 
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born to perform.

Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 2753
Stewart Gordon DL! That's the other one I was trying to think of. And I didn't mean "Learn" those DL's on YouTube. Just watch some Demos of people using them. From there you might see one that you like and you can then find out where to learn it.

As for Daniel's post- I pretty much agree with everything he said. Don't feel bad though. We all feel like we know what we are doing once we have learned a few effects. Then we study this stuff for several more years, look back on where we were, and think, "wow was I green!" The good news is that you seem to be listening to the advice of the guys who have been doing this for a while. That puts you a full step ahead of many newbs. Focusing on your presentation and perfection of the effects you have is a great place to be right now. I still believe that learning a DL is a good technical skill to start working on, the classic pass is good as well, but keep your focus on what has already been mentioned.(presentation and the effects you know now) If you want to increase your repertoire you may want to look into simple gaffed effects that require little slight of hand. Look up Jay Sankey. He is a master of gaffing everyday objects that look like things you might carry around in your pockets anyway.

Good Luck!


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