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 Post subject: Re: '
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 1:38 pm 
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Penguin

Joined: 16 Sep 2007
Posts: 36
sluggo wrote:
It's not about how good a magician you are it's whether you are a good performer. What books or DVD's have you studied pertaining to kid shows?
If you think that you are going to razzle & dazzle them with magic you are in for a big surprise.
What is your warm up?

By warm up if you mean what trick do I warm up with I'd say its the spongeballs.


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 Post subject: Re: '
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 1:50 pm 
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Joined: 24 Jan 2003
Posts: 4110
Location: Milford OH
dmmember wrote:
sluggo wrote:
It's not about how good a magician you are it's whether you are a good performer. What books or DVD's have you studied pertaining to kid shows?
If you think that you are going to razzle & dazzle them with magic you are in for a big surprise.
What is your warm up?

By warm up if you mean what trick do I warm up with I'd say its the spongeballs.


Well that proved it. You don't need to purchase any more tricks. You DO NEED to buy some books and DVDs on Kid's Shows. You have a LOT to learn before you can think of doing a kid's show. They'll eat you alive.


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 Post subject: Re: Overcoming shyness
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 8:22 pm 
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born to perform.

Joined: 27 Sep 2006
Posts: 3120
Location: Everywhere, but no where
dmmember wrote:
CardCupMaster wrote:
I don't know about the other factors, but I have some tips for overcoming being shy around strangers.

If your parents ever have friends over or take you out to dinner with some of their friends you can join in the conversation a bit or maybe, without being pushy, perform a card trick or something.

On the birthday party front, I think you should get to know your younger siblings/cousins/etc. and hang out a little bit with them. If they are close to the age you're thinking about performing for, you will get an idea on how this age group thinks. Also, their friends present a more realistic situation, as they are strangers in the same age group.
I don't know if you guys agree with this but it worked some for me.
-Chris


yup,
I've been doing that for a while, and dbaker_creator, I said I tense up around strangers, not when I perform. By the way I got my first gig, this well help my so called "stage fright" lessen because it's my cousins birthday (4-7 year olds) and I have mastered my variation of ambitious card, I've practiced it a million times and performed it thousands. My point is who's to say I havent mastered a trick unless you've seen me perform it???


As I said a second ago, "YOUR definition of 'mastered' is fundementally flawed."
If you would like to prove this premise wrong, post a video of an effect you've "mastered" :roll: .

"Practiced a million times, performed it thousands." Really :roll: ? I bet. You would need to perform it no less than 3 times a day (for the entire "year" you've been doing magic) to perform it 1,000 times. Here's another shocker for you: Many many magicians actually DO perform that often, and yet have not gained what most would call "mastery".

You seem to believe that "Mastered" means that you can perform a trick decently well. It doesn't. Mastered means that you've PERFECTED the sleights, moves, and actions to the effect as well as the patter, misdirection, and mood. You must also be able to perform the effect without thinking, performing as though it where no different than chewing. -Even THIS is a pail definition of "Mastery".

You think you've mastered anything, let's see the video.


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 Post subject: Re: '
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 8:26 pm 
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born to perform.

Joined: 27 Sep 2006
Posts: 3120
Location: Everywhere, but no where
paddy wrote:
dmmember wrote:
sluggo wrote:
It's not about how good a magician you are it's whether you are a good performer. What books or DVD's have you studied pertaining to kid shows?
If you think that you are going to razzle & dazzle them with magic you are in for a big surprise.
What is your warm up?

By warm up if you mean what trick do I warm up with I'd say its the spongeballs.


Well that proved it. You don't need to purchase any more tricks. You DO NEED to buy some books and DVDs on Kid's Shows. You have a LOT to learn before you can think of doing a kid's show. They'll eat you alive.


Eh, forget it Paddy. Let him do the show and get burned. Perhaps then he'll be apt. to listening to people telling him not to play with fire.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 12:00 pm 
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Joined: 05 Nov 2005
Posts: 410
Location: Winnipeg, MB, Canada
I think its the duty of all of us to try and prevent people like this going out and ruining someone’s event. They may not be in our area of the Country or world but as a brotherhood we must take steps to prevent poor performances. Sometimes that includes yelling at a brick wall hoping something will get through.

There is no way to stop all bad performances but maybe someone will read this and decide to take the right steps in being the best performer they can be. My fingers are crossed.


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 Post subject: Re: '
PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 6:02 pm 
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born to perform.

Joined: 04 Aug 2003
Posts: 2171
Location: Loveland,Ohio (Cincy)
paddy wrote:
dmmember wrote:
sluggo wrote:
It's not about how good a magician you are it's whether you are a good performer. What books or DVD's have you studied pertaining to kid shows?
If you think that you are going to razzle & dazzle them with magic you are in for a big surprise.
What is your warm up?

By warm up if you mean what trick do I warm up with I'd say its the spongeballs.


Well that proved it. You don't need to purchase any more tricks. You DO NEED to buy some books and DVDs on Kid's Shows. You have a LOT to learn before you can think of doing a kid's show. They'll eat you alive.

Paddy, way to pick that up. I worded it that way to see he's response and it came back just the way I knew it would.
Now let's see how serious he is about doing kid shows by what his next purchase will be. Trick! or material...I.E. books/ DVDS. probably another wannabie one show and out.


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 Post subject: Re: Overcoming shyness
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 2:38 pm 
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Penguin

Joined: 16 Sep 2007
Posts: 36
dbaker_creator wrote:
dmmember wrote:
CardCupMaster wrote:
I don't know about the other factors, but I have some tips for overcoming being shy around strangers.

If your parents ever have friends over or take you out to dinner with some of their friends you can join in the conversation a bit or maybe, without being pushy, perform a card trick or something.

On the birthday party front, I think you should get to know your younger siblings/cousins/etc. and hang out a little bit with them. If they are close to the age you're thinking about performing for, you will get an idea on how this age group thinks. Also, their friends present a more realistic situation, as they are strangers in the same age group.
I don't know if you guys agree with this but it worked some for me.
-Chris


yup,
I've been doing that for a while, and dbaker_creator, I said I tense up around strangers, not when I perform. By the way I got my first gig, this well help my so called "stage fright" lessen because it's my cousins birthday (4-7 year olds) and I have mastered my variation of ambitious card, I've practiced it a million times and performed it thousands. My point is who's to say I havent mastered a trick unless you've seen me perform it???


As I said a second ago, "YOUR definition of 'mastered' is fundementally flawed."
If you would like to prove this premise wrong, post a video of an effect you've "mastered" :roll: .

"Practiced a million times, performed it thousands." Really :roll: ? I bet. You would need to perform it no less than 3 times a day (for the entire "year" you've been doing magic) to perform it 1,000 times. Here's another shocker for you: Many many magicians actually DO perform that often, and yet have not gained what most would call "mastery".

You seem to believe that "Mastered" means that you can perform a trick decently well. It doesn't. Mastered means that you've PERFECTED the sleights, moves, and actions to the effect as well as the patter, misdirection, and mood. You must also be able to perform the effect without thinking, performing as though it where no different than chewing. -Even THIS is a pail definition of "Mastery".

You think you've mastered anything, let's see the video.


i made up the trick so obviously its easier to master than others.And yes i have perfected it, and my cam broke, when i get a new one ill post it on youtube and send u the link k?


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 Post subject: Re: '
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 2:42 pm 
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Penguin

Joined: 16 Sep 2007
Posts: 36
sluggo wrote:
paddy wrote:
dmmember wrote:
sluggo wrote:
It's not about how good a magician you are it's whether you are a good performer. What books or DVD's have you studied pertaining to kid shows?
If you think that you are going to razzle & dazzle them with magic you are in for a big surprise.
What is your warm up?

By warm up if you mean what trick do I warm up with I'd say its the spongeballs.


Well that proved it. You don't need to purchase any more tricks. You DO NEED to buy some books and DVDs on Kid's Shows. You have a LOT to learn before you can think of doing a kid's show. They'll eat you alive.

Paddy, way to pick that up. I worded it that way to see he's response and it came back just the way I knew it would.
Now let's see how serious he is about doing kid shows by what his next purchase will be. Trick! or material...I.E. books/ DVDS. probably another wannabie one show and out.


I'm not another "wannabe"!!! I talked to a pro magician thats met alot of the magicians such as jak sankey here on penguin, and he said "You've got the talent" and "You're really into it" I talked hours with him on the phone and he gave me his routine and some tricks I should get, no offense but he is the only positive influence on magic, you all have been discouraging me the whole time, and so have my classmates. Even if i do tense up, I can still get over it,theyre family I'm not going to tense up around them (the B-day is for my cousin). The magician is also sending me DVDs and books and since hes already read them and since he doesnt need them, hes sending them to me.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 4:01 pm 
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born to perform.

Joined: 10 Nov 2004
Posts: 890
dmmember, I want to try and "tame" this conversation before it gets out of hand because I believe your last comment may incite fellow Penguins. Many of the magicians here are PRO magicians, and they are trying to offer you advice-- but you have to keep an open mind and try and receive it, even if you choose not to use it.

For example, not all the tricks you first listed in Post #1 are appropriate for putting on a birthday show.

I think what the gentlemen are trying to get across is that they would just like you to take more time to research and develop a routine and what is appropriate for children before running out and doing a show. Now, if you just want to perform for your family, that is a whole different matter. However, if you want to get gigs for future shows-- then be the professional and wait until you have a real show to give. Can you see the difference? Ultimately, it is what YOU want for your future.

Obviously, if there is a pro magician that is sending you material then he sees a spark in you. Learn from that spark-- take the time you need-- yes, these guys can be rough sometimes. However, it does separate those without spark and those with sparks. Take the time to listen to them, hear what they have to say--- then go out and prove them wrong by showing them you have what it takes to make it.

Just remember, you have to crawl before you can run.....


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 Post subject: Re: Overcoming shyness
PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 8:50 pm 
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born to perform.

Joined: 27 Sep 2006
Posts: 3120
Location: Everywhere, but no where
dmmember wrote:
i made up the trick so obviously its easier to master than others.And yes i have perfected it, and my cam broke, when i get a new one ill post it on youtube and send u the link k?


As I said before, "You think you've mastered anything, let's see the video."

Saying that "I can master it faster cause I made it" lacks any relevence and holds ABSOLUTELY no authority.

As kristenl explained, a large number of the people on penguin are professional magicians with decades of experience under their belts. We've all been the one-year know it all. And when we where, we all thought we where hot stuff. What we're trying to do is stop you from getting cocky.


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 Post subject: Re: Birthay Party HELP
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 8:54 pm 
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Penguin

Joined: 02 Dec 2007
Posts: 66
Location: Florida
dmmember wrote:
Hey guys I'm dmmember and soon hopefully I will start doing kids birthday parties. I'm not a shy guy when I'm around my friends but I start tensing up when I'm around strangers, any tips on how to keep my calm? Plus any trick ideas will be great, so far I plan on using..

Vanishing Silk
Spongeballs
Nickels to dimes
Quarter Bite
Vanishing paperclip (visual vanish)

Any other ideas guys? thanks a bunch
- dmmember :D




First of all how old are you?

second is this your first show?

third drop those tricks you would never be able to keep the kids attention with such a 8 and up tricks.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 11:51 pm 
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Penguin

Joined: 29 Jan 2004
Posts: 26
Location: Ottawa
Quote:
2-If you've got the tricks down, what does it matter how long you've been doing magic. What difference is it if someone masters a trick in 5 years, or in a day? Of corse I don't do a trick once and say that I've mastered it, I practice all the tim.


Surprisingly enough, when performing for kids, there are a few things that are more important than actually mastering the trick. You'll need stage presence and crowd control. There isn't much skill in doing a cut and restored rope, a vanishing silk, a coloring book etc. But how you do it counts for a lot. For kids, you'll be more of an entertainer, than a magician (a david blaine approach doesn't work for kids parties). Read up on David Kaye for some ideas. Take notes, plenty of them. Most of what he says is gold and was a great value for me. If you are serious, look up the book "the birthday party business" too.
My best tip for you at the moment, is get experience with kids. Who cares about your actual magic skills. Plenty of good magicians don't know how to to magic for kids. Volunteer at a daycare or something in this style where you will be in charge of a group of children. Performing for family and friends isn't the same thing as performing for strangers, especially group of strangers. This is the best way to learn a lot about crowd control and all of that mumbo jumbo. Then if that's a piece a cake, consider parties.

And for the shyness, well I guess it's experience. One thing that might help is creating a character. A character that isn't shy would be a start.

I don't want to discourage you, but there are also other things to take in consideration when performing for strangers, like legal things and all that fuss. Reading up on this sort of work will tell you all about it. So for the meanwhile, it's maybe safer to stick to friends and family. If you truly want to do this, take it seriously. Slow down, there is no rush. Remember this is an art, only expose it when you are absolutely certain you are ready for anything that might happen.

Hope this helps, good luck. Feel free to contact me for any other advice.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2007 12:00 pm 
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born to perform.

Joined: 10 Nov 2004
Posts: 890
<< Volunteer at a daycare or something in this style where you will be in charge of a group of children. >>

This is an excellent piece of advice! My daughter has volunteered as a Junior Counselor for 3 years now (she is only 14). She is friends (outside of work) with many of her co-workers who are full fledge Counselors (college students) and as there is always a turn-over of new employees each year in addition to the regulars she is often mistaken for being much older because of the way she interacts with the kids and carries herself.

She has no problem handling the children, despite the fact there is not much of an age difference, and they always address her as Miss ****. She has earned the respect of not only the Administration, but also her peers and the children themselves. You need to have a certain authority about you, but still be able to relate to the children and know how to engage them. Learn this balance--- and you will be well on your way to entertaining children!!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 10:44 pm 
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Joined: 29 Nov 2007
Posts: 2
year of experience and your 12....if your looking to make money you'll need more experience....if its just for fun you might be ok cept for the stage fright.

by your age id had 7 years magic experience....i had been working on performing the tricks at my school where teachers would permit...and yeah to alot of ppl doing magic is "uncool" if your amateur but if you have good visual affects it makes ppl go in awe...to help with the stage fright id suggest joining a team sport or performing it in front of some ppl who are your friends but more like your peers...believe it or not but stage fright will make you or break you...trick suggestions would prob be like coin vanishes and reproductions i could give a bit more advice but id like to know the age group of the children your performing for.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 5:03 pm 
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Joined: 27 Sep 2006
Posts: 3120
Location: Everywhere, but no where
dmmember,

How badly did you get burned?
Also, we're still waiting on that video. :lol:


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