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 Post subject: 'How to know things of volunteers who dont said anything'.
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 10:31 am 
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I am a big fan of Derren Brown, and as i am a psychology student i was really curious how Derren Brown somtimes got a volunteer, and know what they think of without touching him. Which technique does he use. For example, he ask a volunteer to think of a family member were they need to think of, then he just write the just name on a paper.

This is also good example
http://nl.youtube.com/watch?v=YTRuQbYDWkU

How can he does such things, i know a bit bout mentalism but this isnt touch reading and different as cold reading as i know.

Hope you can answerr :-)

Greetings from holland


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 11:40 am 
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oh dear god, not another one... that makes like 2 in under a month.
I'll bite...
Derren does a lot of hypnosis and pre-show work. His volunteers are carefully chosen, and lots of trickery goes on... magically that is. Some of his effects are pure mentalism trickery, some are hypnosis aided, some are both. It's a mix, like he says, of "magic, suggestion, psychology, misdirection and showmanship".


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 Post subject: Hmmmmm
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 1:34 pm 
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Ever hear of a stooge...plant...confederate? There are also post-hypnotic suggestions, and a host of other methods...as many as there are performers. Figure out one you like, and can do, and go with it.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 3:22 pm 
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Ok, he sais he dont use stooges, so lets trust him for once. If he picks someone up from a cafe and just guess which relative name he is thinking of doesnt sound pre hypno ore pre talking. To me it sound like a technique, we all know their are non contact mind reading techniques.

I readed a book were a name called: C.A.G. Newmann was called who used non contact mind reading techniques. In 'contac mind reading expanded by fitksee'he says he dont know yet how that man did the non contact reading at that time, are his techniques public already (they arent called in 13 steps ore Anneman at least).

I am a newby but to me it looks like he doesnt use the usual mentalism tricks for this kind a stuff. Dont anyone got a good idea of which technique he could have use if we suppose he just do it all cold and without pre talk(hypno)?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 3:30 pm 
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According to Luke Jermay, in his recent book, he stated that the majority of the work is not pre-show work.

From my studies, there are different techniques that you can use to obtain effects such as Derren uses. Kenton Knepper is a wonderful source to look for some of this. That would be a starting place. Also, Derren and Luke both have material on the subject that is also a very good place to start reading.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 4:31 am 
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Thanks fallingblood, thats the thing i need. I will look thought it. Luke jermay got interesting books and dvd i see, definately worth seeing it.

For me i dont believe everything is pre talk ore hypno talk as Derren Brown even quoted in his book, nlp and hypnosis cant do everything. Its a combination of techniques, Luke and Knepper definately do something what comes close to what Derren does in his shows.

Thanks already :-)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 6:31 am 
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I got the 13 steps of corinda and annamans book, but in the 13 steps, their isnt anything about non-contact mind reading, what he sometimes does, so for example, let someone think of a name and then guess it right. That should be a combination of effects of cource but still not much to find of yet.

Does anyone also know if their are books of : C.A.G. Newmann, a mentalist from just after the was in 1954, he also had techniques about mind reading without contact. Interesting subject :-)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 11:02 am 
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Heijmans wrote:
I got the 13 steps of corinda and annamans book, but in the 13 steps, their isnt anything about non-contact mind reading, what he sometimes does, so for example, let someone think of a name and then guess it right. That should be a combination of effects of cource but still not much to find of yet.

Does anyone also know if their are books of : C.A.G. Newmann, a mentalist from just after the was in 1954, he also had techniques about mind reading without contact. Interesting subject :-)


Hi, look for Richard Webster and Jose Silva...they are not Magicians' they teach non-contact Mind Reading...The Very advance NLP books also go into Non Contact Mind Reading...now you are not looking into effects but Methods...and it is not 100% effective becuase it takes extreme practice and skill...

Want effects that relate to Magic...must get Everything by Kenton Knepper, Lee Earl, and Docc Hilford...they are the MAN!!!! 8)

Paul Vigil, Luke Jermay, Sean Fields, Banachek, Max Maven, Mark Strivings, Ormond McGill, Kreskin, Larry Becker, Christopher Caldwell, Gerry McCambridge and Many other Mentalists are also wonderful sources for Mentalism and Mental Magic...can't learn enough!


Last edited by honywong on Thu Aug 28, 2008 1:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 12:03 pm 
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Quote:
The Very advance NLP books also go into Non Contact Mind Reading


Which books exactly, as i already do things in nlp for study analysis. Curious which books do this, cause then i will def read them once.

Thnaks for tips honywong, def. will read some of the books of those writers you say :-)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 1:55 pm 
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Heijmans wrote:
Quote:
The Very advance NLP books also go into Non Contact Mind Reading


Which books exactly, as i already do things in nlp for study analysis. Curious which books do this, cause then i will def read them once.

Thnaks for tips honywong, def. will read some of the books of those writers you say :-)


It's in the workbooks of the Mastery NLP Seminars...they do not sell them...can't really learn from reading anyway...must be guided by a Facilitator.

H.W.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 5:10 pm 
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What you are after does not exist. It is TV.

Stay far away from Kenton Knepper and even Luke Jermay. Stick with 13 Steps and Practical Mental Magic and just use your imagination to create what you are after. Trust me on this! You will save lots of money and time.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 7:51 pm 
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One way is the Dunninger Principle. Look it up. :roll:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 2:42 pm 
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Lumas wrote:
What you are after does not exist. It is TV.

Stay far away from Kenton Knepper and even Luke Jermay. Stick with 13 Steps and Practical Mental Magic and just use your imagination to create what you are after. Trust me on this! You will save lots of money and time.
I have to strongly disagree with you. Both Kenton Knepper and Luke Jermay are very good sources of information. They may not be for a beginner, but the information is very valuable, and works wonders.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 5:29 pm 
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Considering Luke Jermay and Kenton Knepper don't use the majority of their published material in their own payed shows, I would have to strongly disagree with you. And considering your a comedy magician, I wonder how much of an advanced mentalist you really are.

I've heard from several respected mentalists/creators who have seen Jermay's live shows and have told me that they haven't seen him perform anything from his dvds. books, etc. Supposedly none of it was suggestion based and most of it was basic mentalism using basic mentalist principles.

Most good mentalists regard Jermay and Knepper as something of a joke. How much of Knepper's material do you actually own. I've had enough of his material to know that it was a waste of money.

I hate to say it, but the majority wins. There are far more unfavorable opinions of Knepper and Jermay in the mentalism world than there are favorable. There is a reason for this....


Last edited by Lumas on Fri Aug 29, 2008 7:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 29, 2008 6:11 pm 
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I agree completly with Lumas,

Much of Jermay and Kenton work is thought of stuff which really wasn't put to practice, much of the times the ads are very misleading and what you see is only the big picture.

There are real ways to make those kinds of routine work, digg deeper, stop thinking about flower fairies psychological technique,

They don't exist.

Max.


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